Copying posts is now in progress. Note that I'm not copying across all the replies from the 51 pages of the original thread, mostly just my own posts...
Editing note - anything that is formatted like this is a modern addition added while copying posts to this forum!
Contents
Modular Urban Table, Planning Stages - page 1
Ian's Monster Terrain Thread
22 posts
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Last edited by IJW Wartrader on July 17th, 2014, 11:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
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Just so long as you include the pic with the AT-AT leg in it then we are all good!!! 
Way of the intercepting fist.
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Athanadros - Posts: 424
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That will most definitely be included. 
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
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First of the copied posts, this one is from October 2010. How time flies. The Exeter Inquisition club had just moved out of the local GW store and although we had a good collection of terrain a bunch of us had got heavily into Infinity and we wanted some more suitable scenery.
The basic layout of the road tiles went on to be copied by several players across the world, including Belkira from DiaCash, the Spanish distributor for Infinity...
Our club needs some more terrain, so next week we're having another scenery bashing session. As I'm slowly introducing people to Infinity some of that terrain is going to be a bit more urban than originally planned...
The plan so far is to make eight 600x600mm tiles with roads on using 25mm blue foam as the basis with 5mm foamboard to raise up the non-road areas. This gives us the choice of a couple of 4x4' tables for Infinity, Necromunda & other SF skirmish games, a regular 6x4 for Infinity & 40k/Cities of Death with more options for tile choices, or lastly an extra large 8x4' table.
To make this modular, each tile will have a road entry in the middle of all four edges to make the maximum number of layout possibilities:
5" roads plus 1.5" pavements gives us reasonably wide roads plus 8" blocks in each corner, so buildings and terrain will be in multiples of 8" blocks or smaller:
Construction plans for the tiles:
1. Cut out foamboard raised areas (covering the whole of the tile from road edge to tile edge at the same height).
2. Glue foamboard raisers onto blue foam.
3. PVA + sand on the exposed blue foam road surface.
4. Textured paint covering all the foamboard.
Once all that is dry, the roads will probably end up dark grey + drybrush with some sponge+stencil work for white lines & crossings. Pavements/raised areas will be lighter grey, probably all the same tone rather than painting the 1.5" width a different colour - that way if a smaller building is placed in that corner it just has a wider bit of pavement around it.
Building construction will depend a lot on the people taking part, but I'm going to try and encourage three separate themes:
- Gothic 40k ruins (we play a LOT of 40k and have a tournament coming up).
- More generic urban terrain that we can use for Infinity as well including removable roofs owing a lot of inspiration to Antenociti's Salute table, Bostria's magnet-cubes, low-level versions of Palocles' foamboard condos and panzerkunst's foamboard apartments.
- industrial storage tanks etc.
We'll go for trying to finish six tiles by the end of the month, and enough buildings for a 4x4' Infinity table by some indeterminate time...
P.S. I'm now up to nine iKubes, a couple of cardboard shipping containers and five (unpainted) die-cast cars so we're not starting totally from scratch. Apart from 40k scenery like barricades & barrels that work really well for Infinity.
P.P.S. I'll also be trying to make road layouts that don't give direct LoF all across the board, so any tips for that would be really useful!
The basic layout of the road tiles went on to be copied by several players across the world, including Belkira from DiaCash, the Spanish distributor for Infinity...
Our club needs some more terrain, so next week we're having another scenery bashing session. As I'm slowly introducing people to Infinity some of that terrain is going to be a bit more urban than originally planned...
The plan so far is to make eight 600x600mm tiles with roads on using 25mm blue foam as the basis with 5mm foamboard to raise up the non-road areas. This gives us the choice of a couple of 4x4' tables for Infinity, Necromunda & other SF skirmish games, a regular 6x4 for Infinity & 40k/Cities of Death with more options for tile choices, or lastly an extra large 8x4' table.
To make this modular, each tile will have a road entry in the middle of all four edges to make the maximum number of layout possibilities:
5" roads plus 1.5" pavements gives us reasonably wide roads plus 8" blocks in each corner, so buildings and terrain will be in multiples of 8" blocks or smaller:
Construction plans for the tiles:
1. Cut out foamboard raised areas (covering the whole of the tile from road edge to tile edge at the same height).
2. Glue foamboard raisers onto blue foam.
3. PVA + sand on the exposed blue foam road surface.
4. Textured paint covering all the foamboard.
Once all that is dry, the roads will probably end up dark grey + drybrush with some sponge+stencil work for white lines & crossings. Pavements/raised areas will be lighter grey, probably all the same tone rather than painting the 1.5" width a different colour - that way if a smaller building is placed in that corner it just has a wider bit of pavement around it.
Building construction will depend a lot on the people taking part, but I'm going to try and encourage three separate themes:
- Gothic 40k ruins (we play a LOT of 40k and have a tournament coming up).
- More generic urban terrain that we can use for Infinity as well including removable roofs owing a lot of inspiration to Antenociti's Salute table, Bostria's magnet-cubes, low-level versions of Palocles' foamboard condos and panzerkunst's foamboard apartments.
- industrial storage tanks etc.
We'll go for trying to finish six tiles by the end of the month, and enough buildings for a 4x4' Infinity table by some indeterminate time...
P.S. I'm now up to nine iKubes, a couple of cardboard shipping containers and five (unpainted) die-cast cars so we're not starting totally from scratch. Apart from 40k scenery like barricades & barrels that work really well for Infinity.
P.P.S. I'll also be trying to make road layouts that don't give direct LoF all across the board, so any tips for that would be really useful!
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
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Some clearer sketches of tile layouts:
Apart from the crossroads and the T-junction, pretty well all of these have areas in the middle of the tile where buildings or other structures can be placed, to stop the dreaded 'LoF all the way across the board' situation.
Apart from the crossroads and the T-junction, pretty well all of these have areas in the middle of the tile where buildings or other structures can be placed, to stop the dreaded 'LoF all the way across the board' situation.
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
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Regarding LoS/LoF issues, another workaround I've come up with is footbridges between roofs, so that even if the street has turned into a fire corridor it's possible to crawl across the footbridges under the parapets. This should also add a nice extra level of manoeuvring to the game.
The bridges tie into some of my rough ideas for building templates - 3" high floors to fit in with our existing GW terrain, with separate roof pieces that have low walls around the edges with some gaps in the walls like Bostria's magnetic boxes - the gaps can then have external stairs leading to them, or join to the next roof, or have a footbridge leading across the street to a corresponding gap in the next lot of buildings.
The roof section undersides will have a little lip slightly in from the edges so that they fit into the walls of the building, that will also allow stacking buildings for more floors as long as the floor plan matches.
The bridges tie into some of my rough ideas for building templates - 3" high floors to fit in with our existing GW terrain, with separate roof pieces that have low walls around the edges with some gaps in the walls like Bostria's magnetic boxes - the gaps can then have external stairs leading to them, or join to the next roof, or have a footbridge leading across the street to a corresponding gap in the next lot of buildings.
The roof section undersides will have a little lip slightly in from the edges so that they fit into the walls of the building, that will also allow stacking buildings for more floors as long as the floor plan matches.
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
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Building template ideas (in metric as the PVC is 3mm thick):
Basic cube is 200x200mm (~8x8") and 75mm (~3") high. Basic form has a floor 194x194mm with walls glued onto the outer edge, each wall is the same 197mm long. That means we can do loads of walls all the same size with 3-4 variations on window and door cutouts and be able to put the walls on in either direction for maximum variation from similar pieces. If I get the door positions right it should be possible to put 2+ forms next to each other and have connecting doorways between them.
The roof uses a 200mm square with 197x25mm walls on top and some little ledges on the underside about 4mm in, this will then sit inside the walls and stop the roof section moving around. In the same way, ledges can be added to the undersides of some of the basic forms to make them stackable. The roof walls will probably have some gaps in, to allow for footbridges and links between neighbouring roofs.
Now the deluxe bit, inspired by Bostria's magnocubes - make some more basic forms but using 155mm as the outer dimension, and some more using 120mm outer sides.
The medium size 155mm form can fit on the roof of a 200mm form, leaving a 32mm balcony wide enough for both 25mm slottabase models and 30mm round-edged bases, and for storage will fit inside the large size.
The small 120mm form can fit on the roof of a 155mm form, leaving a 32mm balcony, and for storage will fit inside the medium size.
The small form can fit on the roof of a large form, leaving a 67mm balcony wide enough for 40mm and 60mm bases.
The three sizes are also distinct enough that pre-cut pieces won't get mixed up during construction.
P.S. I tried some regular thin superglue on the foamed PVC and it worked OK as long as the butted joint was a good fit. I'll have to see if I can set up the mini saw table so that the cuts are all at 90 degrees...
Basic cube is 200x200mm (~8x8") and 75mm (~3") high. Basic form has a floor 194x194mm with walls glued onto the outer edge, each wall is the same 197mm long. That means we can do loads of walls all the same size with 3-4 variations on window and door cutouts and be able to put the walls on in either direction for maximum variation from similar pieces. If I get the door positions right it should be possible to put 2+ forms next to each other and have connecting doorways between them.
The roof uses a 200mm square with 197x25mm walls on top and some little ledges on the underside about 4mm in, this will then sit inside the walls and stop the roof section moving around. In the same way, ledges can be added to the undersides of some of the basic forms to make them stackable. The roof walls will probably have some gaps in, to allow for footbridges and links between neighbouring roofs.
Now the deluxe bit, inspired by Bostria's magnocubes - make some more basic forms but using 155mm as the outer dimension, and some more using 120mm outer sides.
The medium size 155mm form can fit on the roof of a 200mm form, leaving a 32mm balcony wide enough for both 25mm slottabase models and 30mm round-edged bases, and for storage will fit inside the large size.
The small 120mm form can fit on the roof of a 155mm form, leaving a 32mm balcony, and for storage will fit inside the medium size.
The small form can fit on the roof of a large form, leaving a 67mm balcony wide enough for 40mm and 60mm bases.
The three sizes are also distinct enough that pre-cut pieces won't get mixed up during construction.
P.S. I tried some regular thin superglue on the foamed PVC and it worked OK as long as the butted joint was a good fit. I'll have to see if I can set up the mini saw table so that the cuts are all at 90 degrees...
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
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The foamboard tiles arrived this morning.
On my travels through the internet, this photo of stacked static caravans caught my eye:
http://thereifixedit.failblog.org/2010/ ... udge-city/
:blink:
Blue foam tiles, doh!
Assorted glues etc.
Editing note - the blue foam came from http://www.antenocitisworkshop.com/
On my travels through the internet, this photo of stacked static caravans caught my eye:
http://thereifixedit.failblog.org/2010/ ... udge-city/
:blink:
IJW wrote:The foamboard tiles arrived this morning.
Blue foam tiles, doh!
Assorted glues etc.
Editing note - the blue foam came from http://www.antenocitisworkshop.com/
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
- Location: Devon, UK
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I finally got around to digging out the Minicraft saw bench to see how it does for cutting foamed PVC:
The results are pretty good:
Editing note - foamed PVC puts out some really nasty gases when it gets hot, be very cautious using any kind of circular saw or bandsaw to cut it!
It's a good thing that I started drawing out a full-scale floorplan of my large/medium/small cubeform as I'd got the dimensions slightly wrong - it's 200mm/155mm/110mm outer dimensions. Now that the dimensions are checked, here's a cross-section:
Now with lips under the roof sections to keep them in place, and a figure on 25mm base for scale:
Like this, the dotted line shows where the smaller floor would fit:
The results are pretty good:
Editing note - foamed PVC puts out some really nasty gases when it gets hot, be very cautious using any kind of circular saw or bandsaw to cut it!
It's a good thing that I started drawing out a full-scale floorplan of my large/medium/small cubeform as I'd got the dimensions slightly wrong - it's 200mm/155mm/110mm outer dimensions. Now that the dimensions are checked, here's a cross-section:
Now with lips under the roof sections to keep them in place, and a figure on 25mm base for scale:
IJW wrote:Corners. That way we can put extra lips on the 200mm roof so that it can also go on the medium floor to make an overhang.
Like this, the dotted line shows where the smaller floor would fit:
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
- Location: Devon, UK
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If the locator blocks are made smaller (10mm instead of the 20mm seen above) then the large roof would still fit centrally on the medium floor:
Thinking about that further, it's probably enough to have locators on two opposite corners instead of all four. Note that this bit is just thinking ahead, to start with we'll just have the outer locators.
Overhang scale:
The blue foam laid out:
There are a few dented corners but by the time the foamboard is on top of all the corners that won't be visible.
Marking out another tile, the one with two angled corner roads. Starting by marking the 12cm-width of the road in the middle of each side, plus lines 40mm in and points 40mm out from that for the pavement to rotate around the corner.
I mislaid my compass, and they're not much use on blue foam anyway, so a 75mm diameter can does for the moment.
Which gives me the inner edge of the two 45 degree corners.
However this still leaves the problem of drawing the outer radius.
One of my test cuts of foamed PVC to the rescue! I drilled a hole for the pivot rod (and also into the blue foam on the cross marks) and then holes just the right size for the pen to stick through, making a nicely accurate compass that doesn't rip up the foam.
Whee!
You may notice that there are two sets of holes - one is for the CD marker that I'm using for the foam, the other smaller holes are for a ballpoint pen for when it comes to marking out the foamboard - which is the bit that really matters.
Now the result:
Looking good, but the area between the parallel sections of road is only 190mm so no 200mm square building sitting in there. However it's just right for stacked 100mm iKubes.
Thinking about that further, it's probably enough to have locators on two opposite corners instead of all four. Note that this bit is just thinking ahead, to start with we'll just have the outer locators.
Overhang scale:
The blue foam laid out:
There are a few dented corners but by the time the foamboard is on top of all the corners that won't be visible.
Marking out another tile, the one with two angled corner roads. Starting by marking the 12cm-width of the road in the middle of each side, plus lines 40mm in and points 40mm out from that for the pavement to rotate around the corner.
I mislaid my compass, and they're not much use on blue foam anyway, so a 75mm diameter can does for the moment.
Which gives me the inner edge of the two 45 degree corners.
However this still leaves the problem of drawing the outer radius.
One of my test cuts of foamed PVC to the rescue! I drilled a hole for the pivot rod (and also into the blue foam on the cross marks) and then holes just the right size for the pen to stick through, making a nicely accurate compass that doesn't rip up the foam.
Whee!
You may notice that there are two sets of holes - one is for the CD marker that I'm using for the foam, the other smaller holes are for a ballpoint pen for when it comes to marking out the foamboard - which is the bit that really matters.
Now the result:
Looking good, but the area between the parallel sections of road is only 190mm so no 200mm square building sitting in there. However it's just right for stacked 100mm iKubes.
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
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The textured paint that I'd planned for use on the pavements is very textured, and also quite wet to be putting on the foamboard without priming with PVA first.
I put a thick layer on the left end, the middle had about the same amount but stippled with the brush and the bit under the Eldar had only a thin layer.
One thing that's sure is that the foamboard will need to be filled on the edges, but one brainwave I had is to use a thickish layer of the textured paint on the road areas, and then use the sand for all the pavement areas on the foamboard. That will also mean less moisture soaking into the foamboard.
I put a thick layer on the left end, the middle had about the same amount but stippled with the brush and the bit under the Eldar had only a thin layer.
One thing that's sure is that the foamboard will need to be filled on the edges, but one brainwave I had is to use a thickish layer of the textured paint on the road areas, and then use the sand for all the pavement areas on the foamboard. That will also mean less moisture soaking into the foamboard.
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
- Location: Devon, UK
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Third tile marked up:
There's a 280mm gap in the middle, so plenty of room for a bigger building or a small park. 'We demand... a shrubbery! Nigh!'
Each 'horn' of the turning point has space for a Rhino, a Land Raider (by a few millimetres) or two cars. Alternatively, a Dropship etc.
The T-junction next, because it was simple & fast...
Tile 5: the diamond-square. This one was a bit more tricky to mark out...
The angled roads are slightly narrower at 80mm instead of the standard 120mm of the rest - enough wider than a single lane that a Rhino's tracks will fit between the pavements, and just wide enough for a Land Raider's sponsons to fit between buildings placed 40mm in from the road edge.
There's a 280mm gap in the middle, so plenty of room for a bigger building or a small park. 'We demand... a shrubbery! Nigh!'
Each 'horn' of the turning point has space for a Rhino, a Land Raider (by a few millimetres) or two cars. Alternatively, a Dropship etc.
The T-junction next, because it was simple & fast...
Tile 5: the diamond-square. This one was a bit more tricky to mark out...
The angled roads are slightly narrower at 80mm instead of the standard 120mm of the rest - enough wider than a single lane that a Rhino's tracks will fit between the pavements, and just wide enough for a Land Raider's sponsons to fit between buildings placed 40mm in from the road edge.
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
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Now the scale shots:
Pedestrians are probably OK if they duck fast enough. Any street furniture like streetlights, bins etc. on the other hand...
P.S. Not to forget the big stuff. Look out behind you!
Pedestrians are probably OK if they duck fast enough. Any street furniture like streetlights, bins etc. on the other hand...
P.S. Not to forget the big stuff. Look out behind you!
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
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Traffic jam in Blue Foam City!
Plus the sixth tile, the last to be marked up for now:
Next I need to convert the mini sawbench a bit so that we can put larger pieces through.
Unless anyone wants a detailed description (I took photos for one), I'll just add some before and after photos of the saw bench work:
It was quite a bit of work, but the second guide and much wider plate means that I can cut more accurately and with larger pieces.
Plus the sixth tile, the last to be marked up for now:
Next I need to convert the mini sawbench a bit so that we can put larger pieces through.
Unless anyone wants a detailed description (I took photos for one), I'll just add some before and after photos of the saw bench work:
It was quite a bit of work, but the second guide and much wider plate means that I can cut more accurately and with larger pieces.
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
- Location: Devon, UK
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I'm really enjoying seeing this stuff again!
The Display Case - http://minidisp.blogspot.ca/
Me too, there's stuff in there I'd forgotten about!
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
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Watching with great interest.
- Bunny of Doom
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Hmmmmmm saw bench...Now wonder where I could get my hands on a small one of them..
Watching... looking forward to seeing how these turn out!
Lupus wrote:Hmmmmmm saw bench...Now wonder where I could get my hands on a small one of them..
In the United States, check out Micro-Mark.
- Bunny of Doom
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Bunny of Doom wrote:Lupus wrote:Hmmmmmm saw bench...Now wonder where I could get my hands on a small one of them..
In the United States, check out Micro-Mark.
forget micro-mark, I'm going to get one of those super thin blades and borrow my friends cabinetmaking saw, because I can buy full 4'x8' sheets of foamed PVC for pretty cheap! Probably go with MDF board for the base layer, 3mm Sintra board for the sidewalks (unless I go nuts with a bajillion small hexagons...), and more sintra for the buildings.
“I'm curious, son. When has 'This might be a trap' ever stopped you?”
“Stopped? Never. Slowed me down while I load the guns? Every time.”
-Schlock Mercenary, 22 July 2013.
“Stopped? Never. Slowed me down while I load the guns? Every time.”
-Schlock Mercenary, 22 July 2013.
What I found out later was that by far the best way to cut foamed PVC was with a sharp scalpel or craft knife and multiple shallow cuts.
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IJW Wartrader - Posts: 537
- Joined: January 5th, 2013, 12:19 am
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